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Well, if you look at gay scenes around the world, most of the follow the parameters that the US set which is not entirely the creation of the US but an amalgamtion of different ifluences from cosmopolitan countries (basically, the US and the UK).

The US came to finally give the complete shape of what "being gay" is all about, other countries adopted most of these parameters, some of them were adapated to their own culture while others remained the same.

—Anonymous

reply 4606/23/2015
op has such a prejudiced view of our lifestyle. just like hetero people we all have a myriad of different interests and pastimes.

—Anonymous

reply 4706/23/2015
There is no such thing as 'gay culture' it is entirely made up of the campy bits of the mainstream.

—Anonymous

reply 4806/23/2015
Obviously this new format will continue to bring out trolls like OP.

How long have you been posting on DL, OP? Are you new? You must be, because this same fucking thread with the same fucking, lame ass responses you are trolling for has been done so many times before on different DL formats.

Give it a rest already or at least try to be more creative in your trolling.

—Yawn!!!!!

reply 4906/23/2015
Really, no gay culture? How about the style in clothing (effeminate), the diva pop appraisal, the drag queen movement, gay accent and slang, etc asnd etc? There is a whole urban world that revolves around those and other parameters.

It doesn't represent all homosexual men, but certainly, something that we can call "gay culture" exists that works very much like other subcultures such gothic, punk, otaku, etc.

—Anonymous

reply 5006/23/2015
You have got to be kidding with this OP!

I have NEVER seen the Mason/Garland version of A Star is Born.

I've only been to a gay bar twice in 35 years.

AND I'm gayer than the toucan picking lice out of Raven Symone's wig!!!

—SO THERE'S THAT!

reply 5106/23/2015
Do I remember a Very Special "Will &Grace" episode about this? Mind you, I actually never liked that show, yet somehow, I know this.

It's BEING ABSORBED!

—I'm not in Kansas anymore! DAMN!

reply 5206/23/2015
The majority of men who have sex with other men do not identify as gay
That's because they're self-loathing morons.

They can deny it all they want, but words mean things, and if you're a guy who has sex with other guys, and not with women, then YOU ARE GAY.

If you're a guy who has sex with guys AND with women, then you're BI.

I don't have a lot of patience for self-loathing types that can't own what they do because they're so cowardly and terrified someone else who they don't even know might think they're one of "THEM" (whoever "them" is... Richard Simmons, presumably)

Get real yourself [R12]. Just because someone is in denial, doesn't mean it isn't true.

—Anonymous

reply 5306/23/2015
[R35]... no. Just... no.

Why the fuck are you bending over backwards to make it more complicated than it is?

Gay = Homosexual. Period. That's what the words mean. If you bring extra baggage to either word, it's YOUR fucking problem, and you should stop trying to force that same stupid baggage on everyone else.

—Anonymous

reply 5406/23/2015
[R5]: Good post.

—Anonymous

reply 5506/23/2015
"I work in healthcare and we can't say gay, EVER. We ask if you engage in sexual activity with another man. "

More PC bullshit.

"The majority of men who have sex with other men do not identify as gay."

Even more PC bullshit.

—Anonymous

reply 5606/23/2015
Believe me, Sweetie, if you were not "gay in the brain" you would not be "gay in the crouch".

—Anonymous

reply 5706/23/2015
Crotch, NOT crouch.

Goddam autocorrect.

—R57

reply 5806/23/2015
I teach college students--I even teach them in a course called "Queer Studies" (we opted for that over LGBTQ, because I knew it would have to become LGBTQQIA+ and then some--and I am of a generation where the word "queer" was not a proud word to claim but a word thrown to hurt or denigrate, so I have to remind myself to use it). I'm also under contract to write a Queer Studies textbook, and have just finished trying to write about "queer language," and how complicated and difficult it is, so this thread is fascinating to me. I find my students use "queer" pretty comfortably to describe a very broad spectrum of non-heteronormative (sorry, folks, for the words!) identities, experiences, desires, and so forth. They also seem comfortable using other words to narrow or specify a subset of "queer"--gay and lesbian still seem fine with them, and more and more want discussions of both bisexuality (which surprised me, as I assumed bi- as an identity category would seem too binary for this generation) and trans* (as we seem to be referring to it these days) issues. I raised the "drop the T" motto (inspired by DataLounge, to which I make frequent reference in the class) and, while many agreed that T issues centered around gender identity and expression as opposed to sexual desire and practices, they seemed to think the "big tent" approach made the most sense. Oh, and many want to learn more about the "A"--not as in Allies or Asperger's, but as in Asexual/Aromantic/Agender. My head sometimes feels like it will explode.

What is remarkable, and, finally, pertinent to the thread, is how diverse the class is. I don't ask them to name their sexual orientation (because, I mean, that would feel too icky for me as a teacher to ask), though many will identify it when making a point. Those who do identify as gay or lesbian will often use those terms (I've had a few women who prefer the term gay woman to lesbian, by the way). They include Chemistry majors of color who participate in the annual drag show, a fairly soft butch who is going to marry her fiancee in a few months (her fiancee identifies as asexual, but homoromantic--let them sort it out), a geeky video game gay young men, yes, a handful of lesbian PT majors, an equal number of gay theatre major boys, and some who are there either a) their little brother in high school just came out and the parents are freaking and sister wants to be able to know more to support more or b) it seems like a cooler way to fulfill the diversity requirement than taking yet another course in feminism and race/ethnicity studies and it meets at a convenient time and I have a rep as an easy grader who shows clips of Bette Davis, Chita Rivera, and films with genitalia in them.

I've never been much of a joiner--and I have always carried extra weight--so I never did the bar scene much. I don't know that I ever had a real cohort, once school was over (yes, I had friends in my program who were gay, lesbian, and whatever). I'm certainly culturally a throwback (hence, beginning the course with the "Fasten your seat belts" clip) and I find the occasional Social Justice Warriors irritating mainly because they tend to take more air time in the classroom and are relentless in their policing of my and their fellow students' language and attitudes. I'm working on ways to handle it. In any case, I suspect most of them would scratch their heads at the opening question about whether there is a "right" way to be a gay man (which, to be fair, I realize is not exactly what OP said). I wonder if, with Grinder Adam4Adam Manhunt et. al., gay men are looking to satisfy their erotic desires in some places and social ones elsewhere. Other than my partner of 20 years, I've reached a point where I can say I only really have one gay male friend in town (though many professionally in other colleges and universities)--that may be a function of late middle-age and nesting and temperament.

I know: tl;dr, get a blog. Move on. But it remains a fascinating set of issues to me.

—Anonymous

reply 5906/23/2015
Believe me, Sweetie
Kind of speaks for itself. There is a gay culture and much of it is feminized bitchy, sexually competitive, materialistic and culturally shallow. It has to do with same sex attraction, but there are many other ways to be a homosexual men. Men and women born in the last 35 years have less desire to leave one uncomfortable locker room for another one.

Gay life can be tyrannical even for the young and beautiful, who are quickly abused and disabused of their notion of a place of acceptance. Most come looking for love and sex. Gay life is a minefield, there is no need to embrace it fully if it doesn't feel right. Call yourself queer or homosexual or same sex attracted. The rest is political brainwash and a collective behaviour that is fast becoming obsolete. There are more conformists and followers in any group than free thinkers or dissenters. Gay is a group. Homosexual is a person.

—Anonymous

reply 6006/23/2015
[R54]

It is true that lately "gay" has been used to mean homosexual in general, however, that doesn't change the fact that "gay" is a subcultural identity and it is mainly a subcultural identity born in the US and the UK.

Not all homosexual men and women embrace the term "gay" because of its subcultural baggage which is not representative of all homosexual people.

"Homosexual" doesn't have that subcultural baggage and only sticks to the definiton provided by psychology, that is: "a person who is sexually, emotionally and romantically attracted to the same sex" which is basically what homosexuality really is: sexual orientation.

As many say, all gays are homosexual but not all homosexuals are gay.

—Anonymous

reply 6106/23/2015
I'm just a regular dude who likes dudes. No subculture labels

—Anonymous

reply 6206/23/2015

There is only a difference between gay and homosexuality in self-loathers' minds, because they want to believe no one can tell they like homosex.

—Anonymous

reply 6306/23/2015
It really should read, Attracted to the same sex, but not feminine dudes who do feminine things. Thats the real statement.

—Anonymous

reply 6406/23/2015
There is another cultural thing going on here and it is that the use of the term "gay" rapidly spread among Enlgish-speaking countries because the term "homosexual" was associated with mental disorder.

In non English-speaking countries, especially in the American continent where Spanish is spoken, the term "homosexual" doesn't have that stigma so the word "homosexual" is much more used than "gay". The use of the term "gay" in Spanish-speaking countries only began thanks to the influence the US media has around the world with movies and sitcoms in which the "gay" is used to refer to homosexual people in general.

—Anonymous

reply 6506/23/2015
Put the fucking "self-loathing" term to rest, please. A person can be very happy and have a great deal of self-esteem and still dislike and/or not relate to things stereotypically "gay".

—Anonymous

reply 6606/23/2015
You know what you are, [R66]. You know. Starts with "s." Ends with "g."

—Anonymous

reply 6706/23/2015
dude who likes dudes. No subculture labels.
Yeah. "Dude" isn't subcultural at all, low-IQed one.

—Anonymous

reply 6806/23/2015
Self-loathing is accurate. If you are gay and deny the word then you are self-loathing.

I hate what some gays do, but they and I are still gay nonetheless.

—Anonymous

reply 6906/23/2015
Go to samesexbutnotfemininelounge.co - m, then, vagino [R64], you gay, gay, gay, gay, gay piece of shit. Don't come here if being gay, which is what you are, makes you feel you're steeping in shame.

—Anonymous

reply 7006/23/2015
[R68], not really. It's actually widespread and mainstream. Hang around people under 45 and you will know this

—Anonymous

reply 7106/23/2015
[R71], turn on your sarcasm detector.

—Anonymous

reply 7206/23/2015
Like many words in the dictionary, "gay" can have multiple meanings and connotations. People should be able to self-identify as they want to, including staying in the closet.

Great point,[R23]; when sex is the only common denominator it can get pretty boring, and doesn't necessarily lead to deep and lasting relationships based on shared values.

—Anonymous

reply 7306/23/2015
I for one, don't tend to identify myself as gay but rather as homosexual if it is necessary that the world knows about who I feel attracted to.

I don't generally identify as gay basically because I am of the serious and shy kind and not so much of the happy flamboyant kind so "gay" feels like not representative of my personality. I also don't use gay to identify myself because I resent Christians because it was them who spread homophobia since day 1, they tortured us and burnt us in the past and as I sign of protest and disgust with Christianity I prefer to identify as homosexual just to point out all the suffering Christians have caused to non-heterosexual people to this day.

I am not a bitter person, but I like Christians to know they haven't exactly made our lives "gay". They still fight for our misery.

Now, I don't have a problem if other homosexual guy identify as gay. My position is kind of political against Christian homophobia.

—Anonymous

reply 7406/23/2015
[[R60]] Your post was spot on. What a fantastic point. The 'gay scene' can be tyrannical, and high school like. I often feel that the scene is all about gay men going through the adolescence they wanted as a teenager, unfortunately for a great many it extends well into their 30s too. The catty rivalries, and insistence on the importance of status, the shallow appraisal of certain types of image, very adolescent and when you get past 30 become very tiresome and frightening in some respects. It's like you only have value as a gay man if you are young and well groomed, after you hit 35 say, forget it you will be invisible, UNLESS you are physically hot. This is the same in scenes everywhere. It's gay law! Gay guys can be there worst enemies. We box ourselves into corners that we cannot get out of. When will we learn?

—Anonymous

reply 7506/23/2015
don't worry about it take it from me by the time you're old nobody will be talking to you regardless of what you call yourself.me

—Anonymous

reply 7606/23/2015
That's like saying you don't like black culture because you hate watermelons, tap dancing and jazz hands.

—Anonymous

reply 7706/23/2015
[R77] Fantastic comment.

—Anonymous

reply 7806/23/2015
I'm attracted to the same sex but not to the "gay sex".

—Man who has straight sex with men

reply 7906/23/2015
Dear Coleen: I'm gay and I like sex with straight men so why do their wives often ruin it for me?

Dear Coleen

Some men (myself included) like sex with straight men, but their bitchy, insecure wives often ruin what could be or has been a very good time enjoyed between two consenting adults.

Please tell me how I should feel about this. I am gay but I prefer to be with straight men. Coleen says

It doesn’t matter if you’re gay, straight or a hundred things in between, cheating is cheating!

Frankly, I can’t believe you’re angry with the wives and girlfriends for ruining your chances of having sex with their hubbies!

What were you expecting? Are you expecting them to think, “Well, it’s just another bloke he’s having sex with and not a woman, so it’s fine and he won’t leave me”?

You can’t have a go at them. You know what you’re getting into when you have sex with a straight married man – he has a wife!

If you don’t want that baggage and all that hassle, then you’ll have to get out there and find a sexually curious straight man with no ties.

see offsite link on co.uk
—Anonymous

reply 8006/23/2015
Nate Silver described it as being "ethnically straight." Most same-sex dudes are "ethnically straight," especially those who don't identify as "gay." Bisexual dudes are especially "ethnically straight."

reply 11006/25/2015
Agree with [R110]. There is an expectation of conformity that is grating. I avoid the local gay scene for that very reason.

—Anonymous

reply 11106/25/2015
[R79] There's nothing braver than straight men who admit they only like to have straight sex with gay men.

—Anonymous

reply 11206/25/2015
That could be because stereotypical gay men who obviously identify with gay culture are evidently the ones that stand out and look like a homogeneous mass, so, inevitably they become the pattern to define all homosexual men.

Intelligent people understand that, just like any other human beings, we are diverse. Sharing the same sexual orientation doesn't take away our individuality. And even sharing the same sexual orientation we have differences. Not all of us find the same things attractive in a guy both physically and phycologically, etc.

—Anonymous

reply 11306/26/2015
Yeah, the masculine bi/gay dudes fit into mainstream society and usually don't want to be viewed as distinct from their heterosexual brethren. They are undetectable from the mainstream to most.

—Anonymous

reply 11406/26/2015
Reducing people, especially minorities, to simplistic conceptions is very much a human trait.

Remember there are lots of heterosexual men who don't fit in the stereotypical portrayal of heterosexual men as hypermasculine. For example, lots of heterosexual men identify with androgynous subcultures such as Gothic or Visual Kei (Japanese). In fact, most of the androgyny you see in the music world has been created by heterosexual men.

—Anonymous

reply 11506/26/2015
But what did they talk about all night? Who was cute. Who had a big dick. Who is sleeping with whom. EVERYTHING revolved around sex. There seems to be a mad rush to show your gay bonafides when gays are with other gay men. Granted, I don't live in a large city -- I'm in Nashville -- and I'm sure it's possible to find gay men who don't feel the need to talk gay all the time, but here, sadly, they do. I have stopped associating with gay men down here, and don't have any gay friends.
So straight men don't like to talk about female anatomy and sex, Right. Surprise surprise men gay and straight like sex. They also like to talk about it.

—Anonymous

reply 11606/26/2015
OP sounds like your typical religious bigot. Those love to say "gay ifetsyle" even though there isn't such thing as a gay lifestyle.

—Anonymous

reply 11706/26/2015
The only characteristic that says you are homosexual in your brain is its wiring to react sexually and romantically to males.

Your behaviour, preferenece in cloting, taste in music, etc, those are not determined by your sexual orientation. Sexual orientatio and gender expression are two separate aspcets in humans.

Your sexual orientation (attraction to the same, opposite or both sexes) is something you are born with. Gender expression, taste in music and other sterotypes associated with "gay" are affectations, they are pretty much influenced by external factors.

—Anonymous

reply 11806/26/2015
How insightful Caitlyn.

—Anonymous

reply 11906/26/2015
Talking about the effeminate gay guy or queen, as some call them, I found an interesting book that addresses this topic telling that the effeminacy some gay men make display of is very much the result of imitating female behavior in order to attract other males. Basically, they repeat heterosexual roles and interactions where the feminine-masculine model is present.

This happens because we grow up in a world where there only sexual and romatic interactions we see around us is that of heterosexuals.

If we want to answer the question why most gay men are turned off by effeminacy this is it.

—Anonymous

reply 12006/27/2015
How is loving someone of the same sex a liftyle?

Religious bigots love to say "the gay lifestyle" when there isn't such thing, but ironically, religion is a lifestyle. You know, they all have a book and premises as to how mus must behave, think, eat, drink, etc. That is certainly a lifestyle.

—Anonymous

reply 12106/30/2015
I love Barbra/Liza, but I don't know if I want to listen to or see them dancing shirtless.

—Anonymous

reply 12206/30/2015
This is actually a very interestimg topic about gay culture and how representative is of all homosexual people that could be discussed in a different thread.

—Anonymous

reply 12306/30/2015
[R21], I love you

—femme les :)

reply 12407/01/2015

I fall under that category. I've never been in a pride march, don't wear drag, have no desire to have gay sex in front of straight people or make a public spectacle of myself.

—Anonymous

reply 12507/01/2015
Once upon a time, Gay/homosexual is sexuality orientation, now it's just a 'label' . Many people called themself Gay because they like it or because it's simple. I blame for coming-ount movement of mental ill straight married "gay" men legion. Mow I stop call myself Gay 'cause i dont wanna involve with these guys.

—I'm just a guy who just into guys, i'm not gay.

reply 12607/02/2015
If you are homosexual, do you have to dress a certain way, eat certain food, pray, read some sort of bible, etc?

Before throwing the "gay lifestyle" thing, please, define the lifestyle you are talking about.

—Anonymous

reply 12707/02/2015
[R109], Society does lump us all together. I am not left wing, effeminate etc~!! I am sick of being labeled because of the VERY unlikable stereotypical jerks

—Anonymous

reply 12807/03/2015
I'm pretty conservative when it comes to sex but people assume because I'm gay I must get into all kinds of weird shit.

—Anonymous

reply 12907/03/2015
I'm sure those not into the "gay lifestyle" would still use Grindr and post on RealJock.

—Anonymous

reply 13007/03/2015
I get turned off by the effeminates who play the bitch. Most of the effeminate guys I know are the sweetest, most delightful characters I know. I love 'em. But Miss Thing, yeah, thanks for nothing.

On the other hand the fitness queens - your stereotypical Manhattan A gay - they turn me off like crazy. I went to high school, thanks very much.

—Anonymous

reply 13107/03/2015
What is the 'gay lifestyle'? Any episode of Queer as Folk.

—Anonymous

reply 13207/03/2015
Effeminacy in some gay guys deserves a different thread I think.

—Anonymous

reply 13307/03/2015
Just be masculine, bro

—Anonymous

reply 13407/04/2015
Isn't it ironic that the gay men who are most vocal about being 'masculine' are usually the ones who sound most like they've got a large stick up their ass.

—Anonymous

reply 13507/04/2015
If heterosexual acknowledged that homosexual people are just as diverse as heterosexuals are and if some homosexual people acknowledged that lots of homosexual people don't fit in the effeminate stereotype I guess there wouldn't be the need to talk about masculinity and femininity.

You know, putting people into boxes may also feel oppressive so naturally people who belong to a minority get defensive.

—Anonymous

reply 13607/04/2015
Only a tiny percentage of same-sex oriented men engage in the "lifestyle."

—Anonymous

reply 13707/07/2015
I struggle to see what a gay lifstyle is. I see religion and I clearly see lifestyles, but I fail to see a "gay lifestyle".

—Anonymous

reply 13807/07/2015
I think people say "lifestyle" to mean "gay culture," "gay sensibilities," "gay attributes" not directly related to being interest in the same sex.

—Anonymous

reply 13907/07/2015
I can not relate to stereotypical lesbians whether butch or femme. I have no tolerance for male hatred and ugly personalities. Where do I meet nice feminine gay women?

—Anonymous

reply 14007/08/2015
You do realize that if you go full straight lifestyle, it's the highest form of camp and you just fall back to square one?

—Do not pass go. Do not collect your Hawaiian trunks.

reply 14107/08/2015
[R120], same with most feminine lesbians. regarding studs and butches

—Anonymous

reply 14207/08/2015
[R142] Exactly, some lesbians will embrace a masculine personality because all the see around them is that girls are attracted to masculinity so the only way some of them see they can attract a girl is by behaving like males do.

—Anonymous

reply 14307/08/2015
[R143], utter irony there.. I personally think the the gals attracted to masculine chicks are really straight with man issues

—Anonymous

reply 14407/09/2015
We had to adapt to the heterosexual world we live in. Probably, most of us once in our life subconciously acquired feminine mannerisms by observing how heterosexual guys react to the way heterosexual women move, speak, etc.

Femininity seems to work with guys, right?

—Anonymous

reply 14507/09/2015
I think some stereotypical gay men expect all bisexual and gay men to adopt a distinctive lifestyle and identity and get upset when they do not.

—Anonymous

reply 14607/11/2015
Actually, if you pay attention, effeminate gay guys tend to show their effeminacy around heterosexual men they find attractive in order to seduce them. They don't do it much around homosexual guys because it turns them off and that has caused this effeminate-masculine rivalry we know of.

I was reading a topic about this in a forum and one guy said that he is more feminine and that he thinks that in a relationship it is needed a masculine and a feminine (replication of heterosexual dynamics).

I don't think that is neccessary for homosexual couples (not that that doesn't exist anyway) because a relatively common attraction we share is towards some degree of masculine mannerisms, but we have learned that couples work with a masculine and feminine because heterosexual couples that generally work with this model is all we know.

Anyway, this runs through a spectruum, some like them more masculine, some like them more feminine and the same applies to heterosexual couples. Have you seen how many heterosexual couples have a very masculine and dominant woman? This kind of couples are mich more common that we think.

—Anonymous

reply 14707/12/2015
hogwash, [R147]. I observe feminine gay dudes acting like that around gay dudes all the time, and especially around women. They really flame out with their woman friends.

—Anonymous

reply 14807/12/2015
Lesbian in the crotch but really don't like the lesbian lifestyle or culture. No, I'm not a self-loathing closeted lesbo. Yes, it's hell to be an outsider looking in.

—Anonymous

reply 14907/12/2015
How many times has this come up on here??

—Anonymous

reply 15007/12/2015
Behaving affeminate or masculine is not lifestyle though and I doubt there is a gay lifestyle in any sense because there actually isn't any.

Sexual orientation doesn't come along with specific viewpoints, rituals, etc.

Religion is a lifestyle; not homosexuality.

—Anonymous

reply 15107/12/2015
[R149], trust me you are not alone. do not let the raging dykes intimidate you. Go on dating sites for femmes seeking femmes and do not hate men

—Anonymous

reply 15207/12/2015
I often find I have very little in common with other gay men other than being attracted to men.

—Anonymous

reply 15307/12/2015
But, you're on a gay gossip site [R153], so you must have "gossip" and "bitchery" in common with us.

—Anonymous

reply 15407/12/2015
Me Shaniqua

Animated Gif by Cousin E
See Cousin E

Photobucket
—S. McQueen

reply 15507/13/2015

Well obviously I'm a huge fan of pointless bitchery but that's just because I'm a bad person not because I'm gay.lol

—Anonymous

reply 15607/13/2015
Not everythread on here is about gossip. IN fact, people complain that this site has very little gossip. A lot of threads on here are about sports, politics, sex, or even the weather.

—Anonymous

reply 15707/13/2015
Guys who make every aspect of their lives about being gay are tiresome.

—Anonymous

reply 15807/14/2015
[[R158]] Bravo!

—Anonymous

reply 15907/15/2015
I love bi dudes that no one even would even suspect have an interest in guys.

—Anonymous

reply 16007/17/2015
[R160] I'm friends with one and in a long term sexual tension with him. Very hot. But respect him too much to be aggressive (not that I normally would be anyway).

—Anonymous

reply 16107/18/2015
I know many feminine gay women who feel so alone cuz they can't identify with the L word and all its connotations

—Anonymous

reply 16207/18/2015
Behaving affeminate or masculine is not lifestyle though and I doubt there is a gay lifestyle in any sense because there actually isn't any.
I agree, Im not understanding how one relates to the other, or why this discussion ended up being about masc vs fem.

—Anonymous

reply 16307/18/2015
[R163]

That's because Christians came up with the "gay lifestyle" just to vilify homosexual people without actually defining what that lifetsile consists of and how representative that is of all homosexual people.

When I was born, as thr homosexual guy I am, I didn't come out of my mother's womb carrying any holy book or manual as to what lifetsyle I was supposed to follow.

Inoric is that religion is totally a lifetsyle even though most Christians are selective of what they follow in the bible and what not to follow.

—Anonymous

reply 16407/18/2015
I do think there is a strong correlation between being gender non-conforming and living a stereotypical "gay lifestyle." I think of the "gay lifestyle" as one that is typified by aspects of gay culture, including what section of town you live, what type of clothes you wear, your integration into mainstream society, and entertainment choices. It is no secret that feminine gay men are much more likely to adopt stereotypical gay interests and ways of living than masculine bisexual or gay men, who tend to live a much more mainstream life apart from gay culture.

—Anonymous

reply 16507/18/2015
[R164], you will love Mulsim rule

—Anonymous

reply 16607/18/2015
Sounds like Darren Criss

see offsite link on fbcdn.net
—Wesley Taylor

reply 16707/19/2015
Gay stereotypes

see YouTube video
—Anonymous

reply 16807/19/2015
I hate the film The Wizard of Oz -- how STRAIGHT is that!

What's this "lesbian culture" you gals disparage so much? Deciding which blazers to pack for LPGA tournaments?

—Honestly confused!

reply 16907/19/2015
[R165]

I don't think that embracing stereotypical protrayals of gay guys can be considered a lifestyle but rather a subculture. In fact, the gay scene is a subculture in which some gay men gather together according to common interests such as their tates in music, fashion and even behaviour (effeminacy the most common and visible).

Certainly, there is a correlation between gender non-conformism and being stereotypical. The gay scene was esentially created as a shelter for the effeminate gay man to feel free and safe from aggressive society that threatened them with violence.

—Anonymous

reply 17007/19/2015
Yes, and let's be honest. Openly gay men in the world are disproportionately non-masculine or effeminate in their presentation, demeanor, and interests, which reinforces the stereotypes. If more masculine or gender-conforming bisexual and gay men would come out, the old stereotypes would be undermined instead of reinforced.

—Anonymous

reply 17107/20/2015
Hmm, I think that is confirmation bias.

I began to live my sexuality when I was 20. During those years I strongly believed that most homosexual men were effeminate because that was the only portrayal of homosexual men I always saw. My first approached to other gay guys was through the net (dating site). I would usually look for older guys ranging from 30 to 45 years old. I never had sex with any of them, I was just experiencing being homosexual and meeting other guys.

After a time I began to meet guys my age. I met a lot of guys outside the gay scene. Interstingly, about 98% of them were average masculine like any guy walking down the street. At first, I was skeptical of their masculinity so whenever I met a gay guy I would try to test their masculinity. You know, stereotypes are so strong that you are convincing yourself that there are all kinds of personalities among gay guys.

When I was 22 I met a male stripper at a park. He was 24, very muscular and gay. He told me he loved dancing and working out. That same night he invited me to a gay club he knew. There is where I saw a lot of stereotypical gay guys of all ages. Yeah, all the stereotypes in there: drag queens, Madonna'musis, etc.

Majorities are always looking for visible traits to identidy and generalise an entire group of people. Your average gay guy is not stereotypical, he doesn't help to creat a contrasting image about the entire group so the majority will always look for those who stand out among the crowd. In our case, they set their eyes on the flamboyant gay guy because he stand out. Same applies to other groups of people. Depnding on where you live, probably, in South America black people are stereotyped as hip hop singers/dancers; Asian people are stereotyped as spiritual people; Muslims are stereotyped as terrorists and so on.

Stereotypes generally are not an accurate representations of an entire group because most of the time they are based on peculiarities, things that stand out so that the majority can have a contrasting and differentiating picture, them vs us.

—Anonymous

reply 17207/20/2015
[R83], I appreciate that you made those distinctions. Those of us who have separated, self-segregated, and withdrawn from the LGBT community and no longer identify with the LGBT community don't necessarily do so with malicious intent. I've come to realize that a community is something that one should be free to choose and not something that society should be allowed to force upon you. Most importantly, a community should actually provide a sense of community and this is something that the LGBT community has never done for me. By attempting to be a member of the LGBT community I found myself trying to force something that didn't fit and I didn't realize how truly unhappy I was with doing that until I discovered the SGL community. Within the SGL community I found a true sense of community, acceptance, and genuine concern for my wellbeing. I wasn't met with attempts to deny and invalidate my reality because it made them uncomfortable. Instead I was met with people who experience the same reality and were working toward solutions for the problems that plague our society. I rarely visit this site but each time I do I see posts written by people I would never consider a member of my community because a member of my community shouldn't be someone who is actively working against me. When I attended my first Men of Adodi retreat in 2013, a retreat for SGL men, I knew that I had found my community as I had never experienced anything so supportive, generous, unconditional, and genuine in my life. It was truly life changing. There were no passive aggressive put downs, no shade, no hostility , it was only genuine support and love. Adodi is the plural form of the Yoruba word ado, which means homosexual or men who desire men. The Ado were revered leaders, sages, and shamans who were believed to embody both male and female spirits.

On the rare occasions that I've visited this site I've only lurked and have never posted; however, I felt that it was important to post this because I know that there are people here who currently feel the same way that I used to feel but are too shy or don't feel comfortable submitting a post ( or are too afraid to express it) and are unaware that there are other options. While this post is about my feelings and experiences as an African American SGL male, it actually applies to all kinds of people from all kinds of backgrounds who don't feel that the LGBT community offers them a sense of community. Don't try to force something that doesn't fit and don't sacrifice your own happiness in order to make others happy. Go out a find your true community or create your own space that addresses your specific needs, you'll be much happier when you do. I know that this post is likely to be met with harsh criticism but I don't care. I just want to encourage others to not settle for unhappiness as you only have one life and you deserve a community that accepts all of you, and you deserve to be happy. Below I will submit a link to the Men of Adodi registration page. Registration is closed for this years retreat but will open shortly for the retreat in 2016. Please consider it, it will change your life. Adodi also has a private social networking site and discussion forums that you'll learn about if you become involved with the organization.

—Anonymous

reply 173Last Wednesday at 10:58 PM
I apologize for the formatting. I'm using my iPad and was unaware that my submission would appear like a wall of words.

—Anonymous

reply 174Last Wednesday at 11:00 PM
Oh and the link.

see offsite link on adodi.org
—Anonymous

reply 175Last Wednesday at 11:01 PM
I'm not part of what you'd call "the gay scene" but still I don't think it can be called a gay lifestyle because the gay scene is basically a scene in which people with the same interests, especially their taste in music and fashion, gather together according to their similar interests, but apart from that everybody lives a different life, there are no rules, no premises, no rituals, everybody lives just like anybody else.

That's why the "gay lifestyle" is a fallacious term invented by religious people in an attempt to vilify us all because of our sexual orientation.

Ironically, the people who came up with the "gay lifetsyle" nonsense are the very ones who live a lifestyle full of rules, premises and rituals.

—Anonymous

reply 176Last Wednesday at 11:30 PM
homophobia by any other name still stinks

—Anonymous

reply 177Last Thursday at 12:34 AM
Out gays today are an embarassement

—Anonymous

reply 178Last Thursday at 1:46 AM
I don't listen to Barbra/Liza, or most pop music or whatever. But I listen to some. Its fine. I listen to other things. I listen to metal. I listen to a little country. I listen to a lot.

I don't dance shirtless in bars. In fact, I've never been to a gay bar or gay club. Its fine. I might do it later. No big deal.

I don't fly a rainbow flag. But I support it and its idea. I am open about my LGBT+ (yes, including T, trolls) support.

I don't get my taint waxed, but I do, once every few months, trim or shave myself for comfort reasons because I can get a little too hairy, eventually, for my liking. But it isn't very regular.

I do watch my carbs a little, and my diet in general, because I want to continue to be lean enough as I also gain muscle bit by bit. Didn't know this was such a gay thing.

My voice can be silly sometimes, and maybe softer than the masculine straight ideal(?), but most of the time, it is 'regular' and deeper and most who attach to stereotypes can't believe I'm gay from it.

What is gay lifestyle? We can specifically define it, I suppose, but almost no gay men follow it exactly. Myself, I'd consider myself closer to the gamer 'lifestyle' than the gay one, but that doesn't mean I need to hide from the latter or consider it alien to myself. [R176] has got it, IMO. There isn't a need to fixate on exact definitions of a lifestyle - it even defeats the point of the word. Style, not law or cult or whatever. Just doing what you do.

Its been a task (albeit a mostly easy and passive one for me) to simultaneously show to straight people (who separate gay and straight a lot) that I can often be just like them in aspects, while showing gay people (who separate gay and straight a lot as well) that I often be just like them in aspects. It isn't quite so annoying as for those who are biracial, but yeah, there's always 'educating moments' with people where I have to let them know that I am myself, not just 'a gay person' or 'like the straights'. Just myself, with attempts of love and understanding for those of either 'side' (which I find often hard to regard as such).

Is that assimilationist? Maybe, but I also often respect straight people who sometimes don't want anything homosexual near them, and gay people who want their gay culture to be entirely its own thing. I just dislike strong enforcement of their opinions on others. I'm not for segregation 24/7, and assuming that a gay life means 'gay lifestyle'(tm), can be part of that segregation. Its great to make friends with those like you, but I find it *ultimately* better to make friends everywhere whenever possible, not *only* because they fit a checklist.

I enjoy Lady Gaga (really) over working on a car. Oh so gay of me. But wait, if you're interested in working on cars and teaching me how they operate, and you're friendly about it and open to teaching a newbie, then..lets go! Then later on, I can take someone's invite to see a Lady Gaga concert (hypothetically; I haven't actually gone to one), or maybe even invite the car-working friend, if he seems remotely interested. Or not. It shouldn't be a big deal.

—Anonymous

reply 179Last Thursday at 3:44 AM
There isn't a gay lifestyle, but the intention behind that expression is that just because you like the same saex and have sex with the same sex that is a lifestyle according to them christian fundamentalists.